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Join Viktor, a proud nerd and seasoned entrepreneur, whose academic journey at Santa Clara University in Silicon Valley sparked a career marked by innovation and foresight. From his college days, Viktor embarked on an entrepreneurial path, beginning with YippieMove, a groundbreaking email migration service, and continuing with a series of bootstrapped ventures.
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Join Viktor, a proud nerd and seasoned entrepreneur, whose academic journey at Santa Clara University in Silicon Valley sparked a career marked by innovation and foresight. From his college days, Viktor embarked on an entrepreneurial path, beginning with YippieMove, a groundbreaking email migration service, and continuing with a series of bootstrapped ventures.
Biohacking Resilience: Engineering the Human System with Marcelo Garcia
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10 FEB • 2026
1 hour 12 mins
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What happens when you deliberately stress test your own operating system? In this Season 3 opener, I’m joined by Marcelo Garcia, a telecom infrastructure veteran turned extreme biohacker, to explore what it looks like when engineering discipline meets human physiology. Marcelo recently completed a 50-day water-only fast while hiking nearly 1,000 kilometers across Spain, capturing detailed biometric data across DEXA scans, VO2 max testing, HRV tracking, metabolic panels, and continuous glucose monitoring.
Marcelo’s background in infrastructure shapes how he approaches the body. He treats physiology the way we treat systems: define constraints, introduce load, measure response, iterate. The 50-day fast was not about spectacle. It was about testing fat oxidation limits, understanding muscle preservation under sustained movement, and identifying where real physiological bottlenecks appear. One key insight is that movement during fasting changes the signal entirely. If the body is not eating but still moving, it adapts differently than if it’s simply at rest.
We dig into the mechanics behind prolonged fasting, from ketosis and gluconeogenesis to autophagy and immune regeneration. Beyond the metabolic layer, we explore biological age modeling and how tools like DEXA scans, metabolic carts, and wearable data can now be combined with AI to synthesize over a hundred biomarkers into healthspan projections. The recurring theme throughout is feedback loops. You cannot optimize what you do not instrument.
At its core, this conversation is about endogenous biohacking: not adding more tools, but reactivating built-in systems through controlled stress. For builders and technically inclined listeners, this episode reframes resilience as something you design, measure, and refine, just like any other system you care about.
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Welcome back to another episode of Nerding Out with Viktor.
Today I'm joined by my friend Marcelo.
Welcome to the show, Marcelo.
Thank you.
Pleasure to be here.
Yeah, no, excited to have you.
You are just back from Davos where you've done quite a few things.
Maybe we can start with who you are, what brought you through Davos, and then we gotta dive into the meat of the episode.
It's gonna be about fasting and all the exciting biohacking things you've been doing over the last few years.
So may, like for the people who are not familiar with you, who's Marcelo?
What should we know before we dive into the show?
Yeah, thanks for the question.
And it turns out we have a lot in common in terms of my background being technology.
Right?
Yes.
I think I mentioned to you that my grandfather was a telegraph operator of the Brazilian Navy in the 1920s, so a century ago.
And then he built the first commercial radio station in Rio in 1935 for rich aristocrats where he was sort of the CEO with OPM, other people's money.
And then my dad was his intern and with the skill set he learned, he got into analog television, broadcast equipment.
And then as a sheer coincidence, when I started working for Accenture way back in 1997, well, it was actually 95, but in Europe it was in 97 because I was a trainee in Rio before.
And when that happened, I actually started in a project for the World Economic Forum.
So I've been involved with of since the last millennium.
But I lasted just a few days because as I had experience related to television, the project in Rio was actually building the largest television studios in the world for Hedi Global.
And not many people back then with Accenture had TV in the background.
They kind of kidnapped me and shipped me to London to do the analog to digital television conversion, which was the first one in the world over cable.
And they ended up doing that for almost a decade.
Right.
So from the cable and wall project, then another called Tela west, and then upc, which became Liberty Media.
So the first two are now a virgin in the uk.
And I kept on working with operators in general.
The last project that I did was this enormous 1 million hotspot community wi Fi, which was one of the first in the world.
In fact, the first and the second happened just a few weeks before ours, so using slightly different technology platforms.
And it was in Belgium and the other one was also in Belgium, but in the Dutch speaking parts and in the Netherlands.
So those are the largest WI fi computers, community platform.
In the world.
And it had never been done before, so more than a decade.
Just things that would work in a lab.
But we had to get it rolled out in the field and make sure that people would notice or at least be delighted with experience.
And that's how I met.
Right.
The Mobile World Congress.
That's right.
Quite a few years ago by now.
Yes.
That was more than 10 years ago.
Yeah.
Probably something like that.
Yeah.
Like I'm guessing 15, 16.
Right.
And I started around that time getting involved with the United nations.
And I. I like telling the story because I was at Mobile World Congress.
And then I figured out that it was a smart cities event happening in Barcelona as well and decided to go.
And what's quite peculiar is that I completely changed my life because I looked left instead of looking right.
So I'm walking down the alley, Art Cities events.
And there are hundreds of exhibitors and there are lots of large booths, but lots of tiny ones.
And one of them was the United Nations Economic Commission for Europe.
They had basically no signage.
There was just one dude standing there with a couple of leaflets on the tiny booth.
And something caught my attention.
So this is when I looked left, I was like, oh, there's some UN logo thing.
Let me go and talk to the guy.
And it became one of the first smart cities experts.
They had just started an initiative with ES at the university in Barcelona.
And back then they were accepting giant corporations, mid sized companies, but they're also taking individual experts.
They only had this intake for one year and that's when I got in.
They had just created a thing.
They tested with individual consultants.
And I was the right place, the right time, and I looked left instead of looking right.
So if something like shiny object style had pointed me into no going straight ahead, no looking elsewhere, I wouldn't have had the life I had today.
Which is fascinating.
Right?
The serendipity of it all.
Yeah.
And that kind of got me into setting up a nonprofit of focus on telecommunications.
That was my very first son.
And that one was to honor the memory of my family.
Like my grandfather 100 years ago doing the wireless telegraph for the Brazilian Navy because he came from the best country in Spain.
He actually had electrotechnical skills.
My father as well, that was working this.
And eventually I started working with media technologies.
So it's kind of this uninterrupted three generational span of technologies from wireless telegraph all the way to video on demand and streaming, which is something that I was doing around 10 years ago as the CTO of the equivalent of Netflix in Switzerland.
Before Netflix came into this market and was doing all the hardcore tech stuff.
Right.
Trying to do what Netflix was doing in other markets in Switzerland, which was very challenging because it was a very small team, but it was also a lot of fun.
And yeah, so the background is initially doing pioneering projects, stuff that had never been done in the field before.
Mass scales, usually very large clients, responsibility leading relatively large teams, doing the final integration.
So you have to be fluent enough to speak conditional access, but also broadcast, and also the logistics and know each.
You can't be an expert in all of those when you do integration testing.
But people, that aside, they must trust that you know what you need and work together so that the whole thing is seamless.
And that really helps you.
When you're too much of an expert, you can be blindsided.
You think you know more than you do, which is a Dunning Kruger effect.
And when you're trying to interface with someone that really needs you to be flawless in your delivery, you're just assuming certain things because you're ignorant of the scope of what actually needs to be known.
And my position is, basically, I'm always assuming I'm ignorant.
I always have to ask lots of really tough questions to make sure that no mistakes will be made, because I'm the guy giving the key to the client saying, look, we're finished integration testing.
It's now time for you to prepare a team for the handover.
And that was at the beginning of my career.
Right.
So I was in my mid-20s when I started doing this.
And I really think that it makes a huge difference, like the ability to do those events in Davos in which there are lots of moving parts, everything is expensive.
Like, if you want to have your own bedroom in Davos during the World Economic Forum week, that's at least $10,000 for three nights.
So that is a basic room.
Like, it's not even a hotel.
It could be like a pension type of room.
And the three nights is because they always rented for seven nights and you're only using three.
Not their problem.
Right.
They're just trying to cash it out.
So it is very expensive to make mistakes, which is very similar to a technology platform, which if you try to deploy something and you have version 7.3 instead of 7.4, the whole thing collapses because the other systems cannot cope with the information that has been handed over.
So it's the idea of being extremely safe when you're deploying.
And it's kind of this volatile type of environment.
It's very common in the IT industry.
I think most people who work in other software industries, they.
They don't get it right.
No.
How much stress people who are responsible for those platforms are under.
I guess podcast platforms as well.
Like, when things do not go wrong, they're not go right.
That's it.
And I shifted then with the United nations connection in 2015 or so, and I started doing nonprofit work, right.
So the first one called Broad Lights, and I did that with a friend of mine who's a son of the United nations envoy who was killed in Baghdad when they bombed the UN building during the Iraq war.
And we got it together because my background is telecommunications.
His father was a diplomat, but he was working with wi fi and private jets.
So it was related to his professional experience as well.
And for quite a few years, I was the main spokesperson and there was a talking head talking about what we could do in refugee camps and other places, but never actually delivering it right.
Because it doesn't matter if you're like, in my situation, I was speaking with a deputy High Commissioner of the UN Refugee Agency, a BBC anchor interviewing us with 500 people from all the different refugee NGOs.
So excellent message, great conversation.
Zero refugees connected.
You can talk as much as you want.
If you try to do something in a segment that is considerably politically sensitive, such as giving access to the Internet to those vulnerable populations, they'll agree that this is important and it should be done.
And then they'll make anything that they can to prevent you from actually making it happen.
Right.
So they don't want the refugees to be there.
They don't want them to gain skills.
They don't want to be educated.
Just want them to.
To go.
So I. I figured out that the technology was great.
It could definitely work with like a mesh technology.
And then you have a relay points until you find some fiber connectivity that it gives you enough bandwidth.
So that was not an issue.
The issue was political, and this time in Davos.
So working with someone who is working with refugees.
Curiously, we've been to many of the hot spots in the world, like, you know, Rohingya refugee camps in Bangladesh.
He lives in a slum in Rio where I was actually living as well, trying to do this technology project.
And his angle was art, right?
So he is amazingly successful because the governments, from a PR perspective, they want to show that they're not cruel.
They are not necessarily willing to let the refugees suffer and therefore allowing them to have art and getting the supplies in and making sure that all of those processes are facilitated is something they do with pleasure.
So my issue when trying to bring technology to refugee camps is that this is something the governments would never allow.
I should have aligned myself with a topic such as art, which is something that makes them look good and of course does not generate any additional problems.
So curiously, that nonprofit became extraordinarily useful.
And all the work had done before with the designs and getting in touch with the suppliers of equipment that can operate in very remote regions.
That happened when Ukraine got invaded.
So I was actually in Spain when I got the news.
I went straight to Mobile World Congress, started talking to every single company out there, try to identify who could be a potential partner.
And we identified one was Airspan Network.
So they used to own Mimosa back then they just sold that unit to another company.
But they have this WI fi relay.
So it's basically a point to point communications or point to multipoint that uses WI fi frequency.
So you don't need a license.
And we.
I think it took us a month and a half to figure it out to do the fundraising to get the equipment.
And I was on the Kyiv frontline less than a month after the Russians were forced to leave.
So you had the burn tanks and the shells on the streets and everything else was very sobering to see all that.
But that was exactly when all the experience I had, the family tradition and everything else and all the effort that was put into telling the world that this should happen finally became useful.
So we managed to deploy a number of systems close to the front lines.
And the Kharkiv line, which was the most dangerous one back then.
And the technology worked like a charm.
It's absolutely amazing.
We have a situation where they had the specs in terms of what is the range.
I think it was two to three kilometers.
That was a standard format.
Of course, from the supplier perspective, they want you to buy as much equipment as possible.
So there's an agency problem saying, oh, it cannot do anymore because we want you to buy two, three times more gear.
When in fact there are some hacks around the system that allowed us to have a single point to point link that reached 15km.
We basically managed to 5x their technical maximum just by using their own system with information that they have, but they do not share necessarily.
And you could say, well, maybe is the amount of power that is allowed depends on the jurisdiction.
Everything else, it's a war zone.
We just want to make sure that people get connected so they can stay alive.
So we had this extreme case that was interesting.
Yeah.
Because I remember you sent me some information back where you do.
Like you were using Starlink, I think, as uplinks.
Right.
And then at hospitals, I think it was.
And then relay that out to like basically hub and spoke, right?
Yeah.
So the idea initially was Starlinks because we didn't have the relationships established.
The final solution, once the front stabilized, you know, it doesn't shift a lot.
Right.
It's a couple hundred meters because you have the trenches and all the minefields and so on.
We ended up having the.
The perfect scenario is setting up the transmitter on a TV tower.
Because then your equipment doesn't get stolen.
Right.
Because TV towers protects it.
It's pretty high up.
You have a much better line of sight.
You can go well above the trees.
And that's usually connected to fiber.
So you don't need the Starlink in this kind of.
Right, right.
Yeah.
Now ended up happening.
And that's why we had up to 15 km from the TV tower, we could connect to multiple villages that were on the line of sight from the half the way up the tower.
And what happened after more than a year is that during what's called the Kupyansk offensive, the Russia started bombarding all the towers.
Right.
So our equipment got blown up, but at least it was there for one year in the best possible configuration.
And what's really interesting about that is that it can be used in disaster zones.
We can deploy very quickly.
And you know exactly how it works.
And then stalling can be extremely helpful.
So you can have one starlink connected to the system.
And if it's point to multipoint, they can have from a high place, top of a building, or no mountain or whatever it is.
I could literally send those beams to up to 10 different destinations.
And those destinations then would have a Wi Fi mesh that allow a wider area to be connected, all of that through a single starlink.
Right.
So we tested all that.
So whenever the opportunity comes our way, we'll be able to do that again.
So I'm very grateful that we had the chance to do that.
And we had people who support with donations and had an amazing team.
So we're not active right now, but between 2022 and 24, it was very intense.
Extremely interesting from a technological perspective as well.
Yeah, absolutely.
That's super cool.
That's super cool.
No, it's.
Yeah, because we spoke about back in.
Back when you were actively doing that, and it's like, I think you were traveling with starlinks into the country in the very early days as well, right, like getting them into the country the first place.
Yeah, it's pretty crazy.
It was definitely not a traditional experience.
Right.
Because they show up at the border and they tell them we're here to help.
And by the way, this is a business card of one of your ministers and they go like, yeah, just whisk it through.
Try to do that in a kind of sunder situation.
They'll have three days worth of paperwork that you have to deal with.
So we are under a huge amount of stress.
When we arrive with the equipment in Lviv, which is a big city closest to the Polish border.
We were staying for free in a really nice hotel.
So people were extremely grateful they were there to support them.
And I think it's 10 minutes after we arrived, the bomb, air raid sirens started blaring, so we had to go into a bunker.
We drove for like 20 hours and after 10 minutes in town, we had to be in a bunker for a few hours.
So the whole experience is definitely unique and not always for good reasons.
Yeah, definitely.
I mean, kudos to pulling that off.
That sounds like maybe not a fun experiment, but definitely fascinating from a technological perspective to solve those scenarios for sure.
That's super interesting and thank you for writing some backstory there.
The episode today is going to be the remaining of the show.
It's going to be a bit more different than most of our previous episode because you and I have something else in common more than the tech angle, which is that we are both kind of like biohacking nerds.
You far more than I, but we.
We share a, I guess an obsession in a way with things like fasting and, well, obsessively monitoring our bodies.
And the reason why I ordered it up so with you is because of your latest big endeavor where you broke the world record.
Well, unofficially, I guess, because there is no official Guinness World Record for it.
But you are a big fan of fasting and I will dive into that both from a technological perspective, how you monitor.
Because a lot of things around bio is very opinionated and not very data driven.
You take a very data driven approach to this, which I really appreciate.
But I guess before we dive into the how, let's start with the why.
Why are you obsessed with fasting, biohacking?
What's your like?
What was your moment?
Where, wow, this is something that I am really.
Well, I need to do.
So, like, where.
Where did that start?
So you have a book called the Explorer Gene, and every community has a subset, usually quite small, of people who are especially good at Regulating fear.
It doesn't mean that you don't feel fear.
You just temper it.
You control it.
And that tends to come from experience, like the wisdom of knowing that once you recognize a pattern and you have solved similar problems before you feel confident that you'll be able to find a solution.
So these tend to be the people who go to the next valley to find food, just in case the valley where your band is right now would stop providing.
And those risks come with severe complications.
Lots of explorers died because they kind of stumbled as a problem that it couldn't solve.
And I think that I have that right.
This has always been the case as a kid.
They'll be the one going to the top of the hill to tell people, this is what I saw.
I believe that you should consider going there.
And these are the challenges.
So always being the first one scouts to identify and mitigate potential risk, to de risking it for others, because a lot of fun to do that, right?
So when you're confronted with puzzles that are never solved before, no one is there to help you.
Like, you have to do it yourself.
And eventually, even though, as I mentioned before, my first experiment related to what I'm doing now was actually in Davos more than 10 years ago, and it was a cold exposure.
It's not fasting.
I'll quickly tell the story because it's quite amusing that I. I stay in camping cars, right?
Because I'm chartering a whole train with six wagons, and the only way I can be close to the train is to have my own venue.
And that's a camping car because we're in the railway depot, right?
And I have to be there because the problems popping up all the time.
And even if I could stay a little bit further away in a proper flat to cost like 10 grand, and that makes no sense, right?
So we are running this as a nonprofit.
So staying camping cars in severe winter, like was down to minus 18 one year is something I have done, and you kind of learn how to cope with the challenges.
But the first time, or maybe the second time I did that more than 10 years ago, I thought that because it was at a campsite, I could only get back there when the train started running at 6 in the morning.
So I was working the night shift.
So just show up at noon and stay partying with my friends until six in the morning, then catch the train and go and get some sleep and then take the train back in one year.
I think it was the second year I was doing that.
I decided to buy A bicycle, and then take it with me by train to Davos, get it locked at the Davos station, so that if I want to leave, say at 3 or 4 in the morning because I'm really tired, I can just ride back to the campsite, which is what I did.
The issue which I could not have foreseen is that the shock police, like, no.
A group of at least 15 military police, most likely, they're fully dressed in riot gear, you know, the plastic bits and bobs to protect them against physical attack.
They thought it was very strange that you have this dude riding a bicycle at 4 in the morning during the World Economic Forum week.
So they started to stop me to check my id, and they were there taking the time, like at least 10 or 20 minutes.
It is minus 12 or minus 13.
I only had a light coat because I thought it was just going to be a quick ride.
And I had to stand there, like, I didn't have the choice of saying, oh, I'll wait inside the car.
I have a pushback.
And they didn't care at all.
It's not like they told me, you can wait inside the bus.
So they're checking my credentials and hotel badges and everything else.
And once I'm clear, they go like, yeah, you can leave.
But that was actually the first time in which I had to have cold exposure against my will.
And I realized that it wasn't that bad.
Right.
And that was without any training.
Right.
So what I'm doing now is completely different because I do it the whole winter.
Like, I only wear a T shirt, even if it's minus 20.
I only wear a T shirt usually, like this one, the black, because it helped me absorb heat from the sun when there is some sun out there.
And the shift was really in being curious about the limits of the human body.
So trying to understand, we have a genetic code that is identical to 10,000 years ago, or 50,000, even a hundred thousand, when you go further back.
Like, Homo sapiens started around 300,000 years ago, but it do have some variations and have things like, you know, blue eyes that didn't exist and lactose tolerance.
So let's just assume 10,000 years as being reasonable.
These people back then were identical to us.
Yeah.
And they could do really hardcore stuff.
Right.
They were, I think, 40,000 years ago you had hunters, Homo sapiens hunters in Siberia.
So it's minus 40.
It's always been that cold for a very long time.
It's not like, oh, it was a tropical paradise back then.
No, it wasn't.
It's not like the Sahara turning green every 15,000 years.
No, it was really cold back then.
Yeah.
And they had pelts.
Right.
So they had animal skins with the fur that acted as therm insulation.
And all that is measurable.
Like when I am as I did, like I was in some more until yesterday for snow polo, I. I was in minus 3 with wind gusts of up to 17 kilometers per hour for three and a half hours.
Like if you enter that into any calculator saying you had mild to severe hypothermia based on those specifications.
Because your thermal insulation with the T shirt is basically zero.
Right.
It's not like I have a mammoth work worrying me.
And I think it's really cool because it acts as a proxy for being in Siberia when it's minus 40 wearing fur.
And you can actually calculate that the insulation factor of the fur versus a T shirt and how much heat are you losing.
And actually yesterday, so the day before yesterday, it was on Sunday.
It was the first time in which I was doing cold exposure without moving because it was just my friends watching polo.
And usually when I'm doing that, I'm hiking with a heavy load.
So your body becomes a furnace.
Right?
Similar to cavemen.
They're looking for food.
And your food is 2 meters below the snow.
So you have to figure out where it can go that would allow you to survive.
So those were the core elements.
I started imagining as a thought experiment that I am a Caveman in Switzerland 10,000 years ago, and for nine months of the year, I am living close to a glacier runoff.
So there's plenty of water.
I can jump on nuts and find roots and get small animals and eggs.
Life is good.
So you're not doing much.
You're detraining, so your cardiac capacity goes down, your strength goes down, and you're used to having food and living in a warmish environment for most of the year.
And all of a sudden winter comes, so your food disappears.
You have to be extremely good at tolerating the hunger, the cold.
You are in pain because being cold is damn painful.
But you also have parasites and a toothache.
No, I'm sure caveman had plenty of things to complain about and all of a sudden have to move with everything you own, including bring your kids.
Right?
Because if they're age of four, they cannot walk long distances by themselves.
So you need to increase your cardiac capacity and your muscular strength very quickly to survive.
And those are the five activities, you may want to call them sports that are called the paleolithic pentathlon.
So those are the five things that our ancestors had to be exceptionally good at to survive so that we could exist today.
So we had direct descendants of people who had the genes tolerates those extremes.
And yet no one seems to do it now.
And it kind of got me curious, like, you know, how hard can you push this and how can you combine fasting like 0 calories for 50 days?
It is very uncommon.
But usually people who got to that point they had a severe form of cancer or they're morbidly obese, as in they're diseased.
And that is the last choice that I have.
I. I may have some mental issues because of all the things that I'm doing.
Some people say I'm a bit cuckoo, but otherwise I'm very healthy.
And the objective is, again, I'm a scout.
I'm going to the extreme.
I'm getting to the edge of the cliff, I'm looking down and saying, that's what I see.
And then I come back and I do podcast interviews like this one.
I write quite a few articles and planning to write a lot more.
The last expedition is supposed to become a case report, right?
Because I had so much data again, showing people the.
These are 10 of the 12 gadgets I have in my body at the moment.
I have a chest strap and a CGM and a few other things that are not attached to me, like impotent scales and so on and so forth.
And the idea is I will try to measure using wearables that are available right now that did not exist five years ago when I did a similar 50 days fast.
And it was very frustrating.
The only thing that I could see on my scale is like, you know, proportion or weight for sure, proportion of fat and muscle, but not very precise and a few other things.
So I ended up losing 40 kilos over a year.
It was very interesting.
And then the project back then was reaching starvation levels like the malnourishment, the lowest level that is considered to be healthy according to the WJ standards.
And then I stopped, right?
So I've never been malnourished.
I was just very close to that.
And sure, apart.
And you've seen the pictures, that was extremely.
And the project was okay.
Now that I'm in a state of borderline malnourishment, let me try to do something that is physically very challenging.
So I tried to do an ultra marathon distance after 49 days without food.
And I couldn't.
I did half right.
It's quite a Big deal to hike 25km in waiting terrain after no 49 days without any calories.
And my ligaments and tendons, they're so weak because of course they also get used as food.
And the concern was causing permanent damage.
So the idea here is that I push really hard up to the point in which I'm concerned that this could cause grave harm.
So if you're doing hypothermia experiments, there is a risk that you're going to have permanent nerve damage in your fingertips.
Right.
When you don't have to go all the way to frostbite, you have frost snip.
And if your fingers are feeling waxy and you have to pay a lot of attention to those signals because there's no alarm in your apple watch saying you're about to get frostnip.
You have to know what you're.
I have that I have for my navy days.
I actually have like my right pinky toe is like, it goes numb when like it gets a bit cold.
So like I know firsthand.
Yeah, that is probably nerve tissue damage.
Right.
So, yeah, I am being very careful so far.
Good.
And when I was doing this last experiment, so to say, in St. Morris for the snow polo, I didn't notice that was getting my core so cold because I'm having conversations.
I just got invited to speak at the MIT M. Tech event.
I spoke in Toulouse at the European edition many years ago and now it will be the US edition.
So I'm talking with MIT professors and super interesting people, mountaineers and all that.
And once it down on me that it was very cold, that I had to seek shelter because almost four hours with the wind blasting and you're wearing only a T shirt at some point in time, it's not like you're invincible.
It just lasts much longer than anyone else.
And I went into the pizza tents to get some food and because that tent was quite warm, I had what's called the after drop.
So once you are very cold and you get into a warm environment, it's counterintuitive.
Right.
Because the cold blood from your limbs would rush to your core.
So even though the environment is much warmer, your core temperature drop and they kind of get dizzy and confused and didn't quite go there.
But I recognized the after drop symptoms.
I had to go to a place where I could spend an hour.
And then it's really interesting because the protocol is always the same.
Like you feel a bit wobbly and then you start shivering for half an hour and all of a sudden Your core is back in line and then it can go back again.
But this can be dangerous, right?
It could have heart arrhythmias and all sorts of weird things.
So yeah, I went a little bit further than what I had planned to because it was just entertained or talking to amazing people.
But if I am training with a heavy load, hiking nonstop, I can do up to five hours in freezing weather wearing just shorts and T shirts like this is the body generating the heat it needs.
At some point in time, in my case around five hours, those lines will cross, right?
So if I walk faster to generate more heat, the wind that I'm creating is going to be stealing more heat.
So you end up having a negative output and that's when you need sick shelter.
But five hours in freezing temperature is pretty good.
I don't think that many people today will be able to do that without getting acclimatized.
No, I mean it is crazy what the body is capable of doing, right?
But I want to take a step back, right?
People hear about fasting, most people know it, intermittent fasting.
And by doing like a water fast, as it's called, like you've done there.
Like I've done them myself.
I've done seven day water fast.
Like it's when you tell normal people about that, they think you're insane in the brain, right?
Because it's just like, how can you not eat for a week?
And how do you.
I mean, let's talk about the science about that because I think that's really fascinating and I think one thing I want to prefix that is that if you look at almost.
Well, actually every mainstream religion, they all have a component of fasting that's not by accident, right?
We know that fasting, controlled fasting, I presume I, I suppose is vastly beneficial to our systems for like declotting the system and so forth.
But, but talk to me more about the science for somebody who's like, oh, that's interesting but crazy, like what does the data look like?
And when you go into fast, like what biomarkers are you using, what are like, what are you optimizing for and so forth.
Like talk about consistent when you head into ketosis, all those things like explain like the process that the body goes through as you go into like, I guess a longer fast more than like intermittent fasting.
When it comes to religions, I think there's an element of compliance.
Basically saying to be a member of this club, you need to do something hard.
And that's the hard thing.
That is easiest for us to do.
In fact, it's funny, right?
Don't have to give food to people.
Just say, look, no, this is how you prove that you're a believer.
I'm not sure if that's where it's coming from.
I think that once they realize that people would live longer and have better labor output to go, like, yeah, this thing is definitely worth doing, is all part of a structure that makes them have this sense of belonging.
I am suffering.
So is everyone else here.
And that makes it really hard for you to do these kind of fasts when no one, you know will even understand what they're for.
So if you're at home and you're the only member of the family doing the fasting, everybody else is like, come on, it's meal time.
You should come to the table.
And it's kind of weird.
They're not eating with the rest of us or when you go friends.
So you need a lot of conviction to do something like this.
And therefore you need to have a lot of data knowledge to figure out what.
Why it makes sense to do it.
And it was a lot harder, I think, 10 years ago, before two Nobel prizes were awarded, related to fasting mechanisms.
So autophagy and apoptosis.
So we now understand, right, the way that the body is going to be recycling many intracellular components and then replacing certain cells with new ones based on the fact that your energy supplies are limited.
You have to tap into the fat reserves.
And the way I like to explain is that we all have multiple energy engines.
You can simplify and call one engine sugar driven.
There are multiple, right?
Depending on the mechanism involved.
And then the other one is running on fat.
And fat in this case is no.
The ketone bodies, like the better butyrate, acetone, acetoacetates that get broken down, and they're effectively all your body needs with the exception of 10 grams of glucose that you need for your brain and for your red blood cells and maybe for some other mechanisms as well.
And that glucose cannot come from fat, so you end up losing, in theory, the absolute minimum will be 30 grams of lean muscle mass to produce 10 grams of glucose through gluconeogenesis.
So the vast majority of what you're doing, if you're doing something really hardcore, you know, I did half a marathon a day with no food for 50 days, more than a thousand kilometers with zero calories.
That is basically all you need for muscles.
And for every single other system, your brain and red blood cells will need to have Some sugar.
So you could say there's a maximum limit of fat that a human body can oxidize to turn into energy.
There's an absolute minimum amount of muscle that you're going to lose if you want to feed the brain with those 10 grams of glucose.
And my experiment this time, which is the outcome of many other experiments, was to figure out what is the toughest thing you can do while you fasted, and how would the body respond to that.
And it turns out that from my calculations, I managed to reach this maximum fat oxidation limit on average for 50 days.
So I have to figure out, of course, you're using wearable, not super precise.
And it should be doing that on a metabolic cart.
I don't think anyone's going to hike 1000km on a metabolic cart.
It's going to be fairly uncomfortable.
So I'm okay with what I have.
Right.
Because it was hard enough the way it was.
Also, relative data is highly relevant as well, not just absolute data.
Yeah.
And it's also the trend lines.
Right.
It's trying to figure out if all your devices are going up or and down at the same time.
If you have some discrepancies, I don't care if one says two and the other one says three, if they kind of go up and down more or less with the same proportions.
It's just an algorithm, a choice that the manufacturer decided to pick.
And the outcome, one of the most interesting outcomes of this last expedition, which is basically hacking the whole Camino de Santiago without any food.
Right.
So zero calories, but I was taking electrolytes and vitamins.
That was another experiment that I call the Lost Explorer.
And there's a third experiment which is basically the.
The Divine inspiration, whatever you want to call it.
It's the fact that I understand the physiology, but where is the motivation coming from?
Like, why would the human spend, in my case, 50 days, plus the preparation, plus the recovery.
It's been four months of my life to suffer every single day for 50 days.
The baking sound of Spain.
It's counterintuitive in the sense it's like, what's in it for me, Right.
Other than learning and be able to share those lessons learned.
So the divine inspiration angle for me is trying to find a bridge between science and spirituality.
Like, is there something that is part of the motivation because of the greater good, like a sense of duty, Like, I can do those things.
I'm not aware of anyone else who could do what I did.
It's probably the first time in the history of Humankind, that's something that happens.
So it just feels really important.
Feels like I have to do it because I could learn so many things, like going to the next valley, you know, to figure out if there's food to feed the tribe.
And those are the three main elements.
I think the caveman one, the outer boundaries of genetic capabilities, is the one that is the most measurable.
The last explorer is, in fact, testing a stack of electrolytes of salts, potassium, and magnesium, plus lots of vitamins.
And I'm trying to figure out if I give a person who's lost in a field a specific number of pills that are very light and easy to carry.
When you're going through those expeditions, every single life vest and lifeboat should have that little envelope.
Right.
That allows you to remain cognitively functional for as long as possible if you only have access to water but not to food.
Right.
So that is also relatively easy to measure is basically what does it look like at the end?
So is it like a snapshot here, snapshot there?
The caveman experiment has so many variables, like your metabolic age and biologic age and HRV and the stress proxies for cortisol.
So I think that from nerding out perspective, that is definitely the one that is most interesting because the spiritual one is very much about mood journals and how are you feeling?
And very hard to quantify.
So these are the three main angles.
But I think that the one that we can focus on is on the data that I managed to collect and the fact that I managed to reach theoretical maximum of fat oxidation and theoretical minimum of muscle expenditure, like, maximum of muscle sparing, which is the holy grail of fitness.
Like, this is the hardest cut of the history of fitness in general, because please tell me if you've heard of anyone who's been burning 15 kilos of fat in seven weeks while losing only two kilos of muscle.
Yeah, like, every single fitness professional I talk with, they go like, this is insane.
Like, theoretically possible, but has never really been done in the field.
And what's really curious is that lots of animal studies have been done.
So I'm basically the.
The biggest ape that they no tested with, like, not in the lab.
But I feel like I'm the only human who's now showing what happens to corroborate something that has been done with animal studies to prove the maximum fat oxidation and minimum of muscle use and so on and so forth.
And I believe this is very relevant.
Like, the people who don't have to do something so hardcore the message is if you're going to be doing longer fast, like more than 48 hours, you're doing seven, which is great.
I think this is the sweet spot.
I do 50, like I've done two or 50 long day long fasts.
The first one was on average, I think 5,000 steps a day.
Because it'll be mostly chilling at home.
And then you're losing a lot of muscle.
Right.
If you're not out there.
No.
It's signaling to your body that you're looking for food.
Your body's going to use muscle as food.
So I was doing Nordic pole hiking, so full body workout.
And I think this is what kept my muscles in shape.
So if anyone wants to do like a week long fast, I would highly recommend them to go hiking.
It doesn't have to be hardcore.
Right.
But this is what allows them to maximize the benefits.
Yeah.
I mean, for me, the reason why I got into fasting in the first place was purely about, I mean, longevity.
Right.
It's about making sure my body is detoxed.
Right.
And fasting is probably the most effective way to kind of reset your body.
Right.
And for me, what I'm really optimizing for when I do this stuff is really, it's like I don't want to live until I'm 200, but I want to live until my 70s, 80s and really.
Well, why would you not want to live into 200 if you have a healthy.
Oh yeah, I'm not saying, I'm not saying I wouldn't want to.
I'm just saying is I want my optimizing for.
Because that ultimately comes down to what the size looks like in the future.
Right.
Fast.
All the amount of fasting in the world is not gonna make you live to 200.
So that always comes down to like what the size looks like in our lifetime then presumably.
Right.
But I think for me, one thing that you mentioned recently was the pheno age, which is a real interesting calculator right off.
Like, what does your actually biological age look like?
Because for me those are more interesting variables than most.
Like how do you figure out, how do you quantify every single wearable today will have some kind of like proxy for your biological age.
Right.
Tell me more about that.
Like photo age.
How does it compare to what is it first of all, I guess, and how does it compare to the other benchmarks?
And presumably you are tracking it across multiple types.
So like, how does it actually correlate or not correlate?
Yeah.
The thing is Each organ will age at a different speed.
So I need reading glasses because my cornea is getting harder and doesn't focus as well, have trouble understanding people in very noisy environments.
Right.
So I'm assuming that those two systems, they're aging on par or maybe a little bit slower than what other people would experience.
I don't have a lot of gray hair.
Right.
Like, I'm 55 years old and most people are quite gray now.
But inside, my body operates at a much younger age.
So the.
The metabolic outcome that I have with Hume, because I use their scale and the band and they kind of match results to give you, I would say, one of the best, most precise results you can have because you're using two different gadgets to get us information.
It says that I'm 28, right?
Right.
So you go like, okay, no, from 55 to 28, it's a massive jump.
And how does that work?
Like, it depends on how they define the algorithm.
So the one thing is from two weeks ago that did a VO2 max test for the first time, a metabolic car to the mask and the measuring lactates and so on and so forth.
And they're first very puzzled because my lactate results were very weird.
And I'm coming out of 50 days of fasting, so I could be related to that.
In three months, we're going to do it again and try to understand, was that a blip?
But it just did not make any sense.
However, my maximum heart rate, which is something that typically people say, oh, it's 220 minus or age.
And then when you're doing your zone two training, you should between 60 and 17% of that number.
Mine is 27 years old.
So bit of an issue there.
Right.
So my heart behaves like it's half my actual chronological age.
So my whole life I've been under training because I'm assuming that once I reach a specific heartbeat that is 70% of my theoretical maximum heart rate, I'm in zone two.
I'm not.
I should be going much higher, like 27 to 28 bpm higher to actually get in zone 2.
So I've been struggling to get my VO2 max up.
It's like, you know, I'm doing everything right.
What is the issue that.
The issue is that I'm not normal according to that specific criteria.
And when you kind of throw that in GPT, you say, well, can you tell me the maximum heart rates of master's athletes and senior masters athletes and everything else?
And the outcome and I learned that 10 days ago.
Is that even at the highest levels, like the very best senior masters athletes of in my age group, I'm still an outlier.
Like I'm still 0.1% of the very best of them.
Where is that coming from?
I don't know.
But it does explain why Hume thinks that I'm 27 or 28 in this case.
I was 27 once and now it's being most 28.
So maybe that's what's being measured.
Right.
So if the algorithm is saying, well, your heart is really good at going up very high and then coming down very fast, you get a better score, does that mean my kidneys are 27?
I don't know.
I. I do know that when you're fasting, all the trash that you have inside your cells will be processed right to become energy.
And the kidney doesn't really shrink that much.
The liver shrinks like 15 to 20%.
So your liver is being used as food because you not eating, you don't really need the liver, do you?
So it's obviously losing the basic functions.
And I think the gut lining and the gut cells, they get reduced by 25, 30.
I have to check on those numbers, but it's significantly more than in the case of the liver and kind of similar to no more than the kidney and similar to liver.
And then you have the thymus, which gets reduced by up to 65%.
So the Times where your immune T cells are being produced shrinks by two thirds while they're doing the super long fast.
And that's probably because of timeic involution.
Like as you get older, the islands that produce the immunity cells, they get surrounded by fat.
So you're just using that fat as food, therefore it gets much smaller.
But the one thing that happens that is super interesting and not trivial is that you get that fat back, right?
So it's not like your cell production capacity goes up, but you start producing more naive T cells.
So they're better at fighting infections because they are more trigger happy.
So as you get older, your T cells sort of get lazy.
Go like, yeah, no, we fought that battle before.
So let's not, you know, move too quickly.
But if your T cells are naive, they go like, no, I don't like this guy.
I'm gonna no smash his face.
And that allows you to be more responsive when it comes to fighting infections.
So I recover from any sniffles very quickly.
I'm not sure how that correlates with timeic involution.
And the fasting and everything else.
I'm just happy that no, I recover faster than everybody else.
And I feel that's the very long term.
Fasting is part of it.
I do it once every five years.
It's such a massive shock in the system that I do not want to do that so too frequently.
But seven day fasts throw them my way any day.
I. Yeah, I do it.
I used to do it once a year.
That was.
I used to do it like the weekly of my birthday.
I used to do like a cleanse.
Like a seven day cleanse.
I actually skipped it last year because I.
To your point about.
Well, it's really difficult in a social environment to do a.
To do a.
Particularly if you run a family.
Like, it's really difficult to do.
But the other thing that I reassessed and actually changed my strategy this past year to doing, I do one meal a day instead of keto plus one meal a day.
I do that for a longer period.
Yeah, that's what I did permanently instead.
So like I switched from doing a seven day fast to like permanently doing one meal a day plus keto.
And the reason is purely sustainability.
Right.
Because I felt like I have so much stuff going on right now that I don't have the bandwidth to go into a seven day fast.
Because your productivity just tanks after 48 hours.
You could probably do walking, like you mentioned.
That's fine.
But trying to do any critical thinking or doing any hard work I find extremely difficult.
But I'm curious how you find that.
It was actually okay.
Like I was on average hiking half a marathon a day.
Yeah, it's an underlazing terrain, but over 50 days you go up the equivalent of 2 Everest.
Right.
So it's the 16 vertical kilometers.
And I was having conf calls.
Like I was not very active and I sounded like death incarnate.
Because you taught a voice.
Cause like this when you're so exhausted.
Everything else but cognitively it was fine.
Like I could definitely understand, but I would intervene whenever required.
It's just scary as hell.
When I open my mouth, people are like, no, are you okay?
It's like, define okay.
I haven't eaten for five weeks.
But yeah.
So I. I remain functional.
Which is amazing.
Yeah.
Because I mean some people, because I have a lot of friends.
A lot.
I have a few friends who do also fasting.
And some people say that once they hit the ketosis, which you happen about 48 hours into a fast.
Right.
Then your body switches energy source, they feel clarity I can't say that I feel that, but I know some people do say that they feel clarity after hit ketosis.
I'm curious about your thought about that.
Oh, for sure.
So after two and a half days of my trick to get into full ketosis is to start on a Friday afternoon.
And then during the weekend, I just binge watch all the cool films and things that I wanted to see for a long time.
So you distract yourself during the transition phase and when you wake up on Monday, you're good to go.
Like, as in, I know based on previous calculations in terms of weight loss over very long periods, the regression curve is very neat.
Like, you have the straight line, even if it's zigging quite a bit.
And based on all the elements I have at hand and knowing my body and how I respond to this kind of extreme fast, I could have gone 100 days.
I stopped at 50, but I could have fasted for another 50 days until start having organ failure.
And that's crazy.
Like for almost a third of the year, you can have no food.
And that's what their bodies are designed to do.
Now we're the descendants of the people who are capable of doing that because otherwise they wouldn't be around.
I was just gonna say it's crazy in the sense of what we're used to in the day to day basis, but using your narrative about the caveman, it's really not that crazy that those were the harsh realities that we lived through.
Right?
Yeah.
And that's what I'm trying to find out.
Like when I'm prancing around on a T shirt and zero, like zero is easy.
Like I can keep on going for five hours.
I know that for a fact.
But when is minus three with the wind, then it starts.
Once it's dangerous very fast.
So you have to know what you're doing and you need to understand the consequences and how to respond to those.
But they had to do that because that was the only option.
So what I to do is to always do it in a safe place so that I can rescue myself.
Like, and if enough happened of me collapsing or anything more serious.
But if it does happen, people are around, then they'll know what to do.
And that allows me to do pretty extreme things that will go to the edge of what the human can do.
The fact that I'm healthy and fit and everything else is not the case of someone with this severe cancer, stage four.
And that's the only thing they can rely on or morbid Obese, that probably helps a lot.
Right.
So my body is more equivalent to a standard caveman than those who have a very severe disease.
And that makes it more relevant.
Like anyone else who's not diseased should be able to benefit from lessons learned and is usually going to be a scale down version.
Maybe it's like a 10x version.
So don't do 50 days, do 5, don't hike for 5 hours and a T shirt, maybe remove two layers from the clothes that you usually wear for specific weather situation and feel uncomfortable.
Right.
Until you can figure out how your body would respond to that.
And then you can no evolve this metabolic adaptation to allow you to do things that you didn't believe that you could before.
Yeah, but I think that ultimately this comes down to willpower.
Right.
I mean when people ask me like about like fasting or stuff like that, I'm like, it's not something I would recommend to people because it requires a very specific personality type and somebody who's like.
Because it's all like, if you're doing a seven day fast or like even longer, you need to be in a very special headspace to do that.
Because most people would give up.
Right.
That's just the reality of it.
Right.
And I think that's the important part.
Like I, yes, fasting is very beneficial, but you really need to be convinced intrinsically that this is something that you really want to do.
Because it would be lying.
Say that it's easy, right?
Yeah, you can definitely train, like zone out from the difficulties, right?
Yeah.
So when you're doing it with exercise, like this is really tough, but that's exactly what you're supposed to be doing.
If you have no food 10,000 years ago, you are desperately looking for food, meaning you're moving, you're doing hard things and so on.
So my hack is binary.
Like that's what I have.
So there are no pills, there are no codes, there's nothing that could make it easier for me.
And it's well aligned with the stoicism.
Like you just don't bother so much about the things you cannot change.
And because now it's so easy to change things, people go lazy, they don't have as much resilience.
And I, I just have this thought experiments, like I'm not me, I'm a caveman.
I don't have pills and jabs and no insulating layers.
I have to cope with the scenario that I defined.
And I think once you have those binary choices which fasting is right?
It's like 01.
Either you're eating or you're not eating.
You will force your body into hermesis.
Like this is very uncomfortable but yet very useful state in which you're cleansing yourself and you're kind of shocking the system.
It's the same as going for a jog, right, but without harming your knees in the process.
So the idea of walking around, what I do is rucking.
I'm basically walking with good boots.
And because we spent half of our lives or two thirds of our lives with our feet inside boxes, that is not natural, right?
So our feet are all deformed.
So I wear boots because my feet are deformed.
And this is how I can compensate for deformity.
That is not my fault, it's not my parents fault is the way society evolves.
So I tried once to hike 50 kilometers in a day wearing sandals because Roman legionnaires could.
And then three years later I still have to deal with the micro fractures from that stupid experience.
So yes, they could because they grew up wearing sandals and the feet are not deformed.
And I was just trying to do the same, but using a different toolkit, which is basically modern feet.
And nope, it took me a while.
Now finally, I don't feel it as much as before.
Also, I do think what the life expectancy of Romans was like in the 30s or 40s as well, which is also a variable in the equation.
I suppose.
There were Romans who lived to 100.
Right.
The thing is that there's this infant mortality which is extremely high and people get to all the averages.
So if you manage to get to your 40s or 50s, you wouldn't have many of the modern diseases, right.
Because these guys are not chewing on sugar sticks the whole day.
And they didn't have, I mean diabetes existed, but only type 1, type 2 diabetes I think is a modern disease.
So they didn't have any of those that are gonna.
I think cardiology became a specialty quite recently because heart attacks were extremely uncommon until 100 years ago.
And all of a sudden you have mainly sugar, right?
And no sugar in the shape of alcohol that is causing all of those issues.
The Romans had none of that.
They'll have parasites, they'll have infectious diseases and all sorts of things.
But if they manage to survive those, they could live to a very old age.
There are cases documented of Romans living more than 100 years.
So.
fair enough.
Make of that.
Yeah, fair enough.
All right, so just wrapping up here for today.
I mean this has been super interesting.
I love to learn more.
But what I'm curious about is what's the next challenge?
Well, the next challenge is packaging this in a way that is useful to people.
So by doing this podcast and preparing the case report, I split it into the preparation phase, which, depending on how you look at it, could be years.
I started doing this almost ten years ago, but I posted about it in April last year and then kind of forgot.
And I posted it as a stab, saying, this is a challenge.
It's now public.
If I don't do that, I don't think people say, oh, you're chicken out.
Because of course, ridiculously difficult to hike a thousand kilometers with no food.
But I wanted to have something out there to say, you're gonna do this and it's right.
You can't really do it during summer because it's way too hot.
And when winter comes, all the hotels close and you don't have the safety you would have with lots of people around.
So I just put myself into a situation where I had to do it between September, November.
That's exactly what happened.
And 50 days doing 50 days recovering, right?
And doing DEXA scans and checking the body proportions.
I just did an in body scan yesterday, so I'm trying to use as many gold standard devices as possible for what I'm looking for because the DEXA doesn't give you a cell or a phase shift and they embody the more expensive ones they would.
So collection of this day back to normal.
On 31st December, the very end of the year, I finished my recovery phase.
And ever since, like the last month or so, it's being growth like it's like my body reached homeostasis.
So I am 10 kilos lighter than it was before.
And it's basically all that out of the.
The 15 kilos of fat that I burned, I know regained five and a bit, which is normal natural.
You always have this kind of overshoots effect and then kind of bounces back a little bit.
And the idea now is to show how strong it can become.
Like the fact that having such a shock into the system does not prevent me from having a very healthy life from now on, with or without fasting, I want to keep on doing fast in terms of having.
So this project hasn't wrapped yet, but the next one that could be interesting would be to hike the Everest base camp just in shorts and T shirts without food.
So you're going up, I think at least 5km.
I have to check the specs.
But you know the things that are.
Going to kill you is a queue up to queue to get up.
No, but the base cam does not have a queue.
Right.
The queue is when you.
You're closer to this.
Right.
And I think this is feasible.
Usually we go there around October because you have the best possible weather.
You don't go there in May when people try to do the summits because that's the best time to attempt summiting.
And I'm fine hiking in shorts and T shirts when it's minus five.
Right.
And they're going up trails.
And I love to have a team that is doing the tests that I do myself with better equipment.
So it's a frustration from the first 50 days fast in 2020, that was a very big driver to do it again.
But measuring everything because now we can all the wearables that we have, even if they're not perfect, I can do a DEXA before and a DEXA after and then in between, I want to have the data points connecting those two endpoints.
And yeah, so I'll say Everest Basecamp would be the one that I'll consider.
It's not going to be 50 days because you can do it in two or three weeks.
But that could be a very neat one.
And lots of people, they were very reticent to be involved with my project because they're like, you're going to kill yourself.
Like, maybe.
But no, I'm not very good at killing myself and not for lack of trying.
Right.
I've been doing lots of really hardcore stuff.
You know, some of the stories.
This time it's about gathering relevant information that can benefit as many people as possible.
So I'm calling that the endogenous biohacking framework.
Exogenous, meaning you're taking pills and jabs.
And the one thing that worries me is that you have people saying, oh, I'm going to live to 120 because I'm taking the right pills.
Like, no, you want.
The pills are irrelevant if you're not taking care of the core.
Like, what I'm doing, that's everybody should consider, like the Levine pheno age.
I'm collecting as many gold standard measurement points as possible.
Blood tests and the pressure and the dexes and now the metabolic art results.
And I'm throwing those results into GPT and then having a conversation.
GPT based on those markers you just locked.
How long is my health span supposed to be?
As in living independently, doing whatever.
And right now it's 100 years old, so I should be Nope.
By myself, hopefully with the family and friends hanging out and all that.
But I should be able to live alone 45 years from now.
And I was asking about.
Yeah, yeah, the things that.
Because I'm giving GPT more than a hundred measurement points, including the inflammation levels and the liver markers and so on.
And there's so much public data there saying, oh, your GGT is fantastic, and this is the database that we're using as a reference.
And then it does this blend.
It says, look, no, your lipid panel is great and everything else that you can see is on the sweet spot.
So it doesn't have to be like my maximum heart rate, which is insanely good, as in is an outlier.
Even considering the elite athletes that win all the gold medals, I'm still in the 0.1% in that category.
This is freakish.
I have an idea where it comes from.
I would love to know more about that, but everything else blended gives me a longevity of 110.
Maybe for 10 years of my life, I'll need to be taken care of.
But then again, this is 50 years.
In fact, when I turned 55, I finally entered middle age.
Right.
If I'm going to be living until 110, and that gives you a completely different perspective, I highly recommend that people collect as much data as possible.
Throw that on the GPT and ask how long am I going to live independently and my total lifespan?
I couldn't agree more.
That's what I've been doing.
I've been collecting my own vault of data over the last 10 years.
And that's exactly it.
Combine that into one data set, have a model review it, compare it to the data and the latest papers and I mean, that's.
We couldn't do that a few years.
Ago, which is amazing, Marcello, but it has to be.
Yeah, you need to be very wealthy now.
You pay 20 bucks a month and you're good to go.
That's right.
That's right.
Marcel, this has been a pleasure.
I would love to have you on at some point in the future doing some more deep dive into your biohealth biohacking.
But thank you so much for coming on the show today and I appreciate it.
Have a good one.
Talk soon.
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